Clarification/Follow-up by Chouxxx on 08/27/04 11:47 am:
The Swift Vets Ad was pure smear and character assasination, Elliot. THAT WAS THE POINT!!

The end DOES NOT justify the means, or does it? Frankly, I was disgusted by the gossip and lies.

Clarification/Follow-up by Itsdb on 08/27/04 12:09 pm:
Choux, it ain't a smear if it's the truth. THAT'S THE POINT...besides the fact that Kerry's 'band of brothers' are not the only Vietnam vets with the right to speak their mind or have a monopoly on the truth. It's beginning to not even matter as another that served with Kerry has had enough.

"Retired Rear Adm. William L. Schachte Jr. said Thursday in his first on-the-record interview about the swift boat veterans dispute that "I was absolutely in the skimmer" in the early morning on Dec. 2, 1968, when Lt. (j.g.) John Kerry was involved in an incident that led to his first Purple Heart.

"Kerry nicked himself with a M-79 [grenade launcher]," Schachte said in a telephone interview from his home in Charleston, S.C. He said, "Kerry requested a Purple Heart."

Schachte, also a lieutenant junior grade, said he was in command of the small boat called a Boston whaler or skimmer, with Kerry aboard in his first combat mission in the Vietnam War. The third crew member was an enlisted man, whose name Schachte did not remember.

Two enlisted men who appeared at the podium with Kerry at the Democratic National Convention in Boston have asserted that they were alone in the small boat with Kerry, with no other officer present. Schachte said it "was not possible" for Kerry to have gone out alone so soon after joining the swift boat command in late November 1968.

Kerry supporters said no critics of the Democratic presidential nominee ever were aboard a boat with him in combat. Washington lawyer Lanny Davis has contended that Schachte was not aboard the Boston whaler and says the statement that Schachte was aboard in Unfit for Command undermines that critical book's credibility.

Schachte until now has refused to speak out publicly on this question and agreed to give only two interviews. One was a television interview with Lisa Meyers of NBC News, for broadcast Thursday night. The second was a print interview with me, for publication today.

Schachte described the use of the skimmer operating very close to shore as a technique that he personally designed to flush enemy forces on the banks of the Mekong River so that the larger swift boats could move in. Around 3 a.m. on Dec. 2, Schachte said, the skimmer -- code-named "Batman" -- fired a hand-held flare. He said that after Kerry's M-16 rifle jammed, the new officer picked up the M-79 and, "I heard a 'thunk.' There was no fire from the enemy," he said.

Patrick Runyon and William Zaladonis are the two enlisted men who said they were aboard the skimmer and did not know Schachte. However, two other former officers interviewed Thursday confirmed that Schachte was the originator of the technique and always was aboard the Boston whaler for these missions.

Grant Hibbard, who as a lieutenant commander was Schachte's superior officer, confirmed that Schachte always went on these skimmer missions and said, "I don't think he [Kerry] was alone" on his first assignment. Hibbard said he had told Kerry to "forget it" when he asked for a Purple Heart.

Ted Peck, another swift boat commander, said, "I remember Bill [Schachte] telling me it didn't happen" -- that is, Kerry getting an enemy-inflicted wound. He said it would be "impossible" for Kerry to have been in the skimmer without Schachte.

"I was astonished by Kerry's version" [in his book Tour of Duty] of what happened Dec. 2, Schachte said Thursday. When asked to support the Kerry critics in the swift boat controversy, Schachte said, "I didn't want to get involved." But he said he gradually began to change his mind when he saw his own involvement and credibility challenged, starting with Davis on CNN's "Crossfire" on Aug. 12.

The next time he saw Kerry after the first Purple Heart incident, Schachte said, was "about 20 years" later on the U.S. Senate subway in the basement of the Russell Senate Office Building. "I called, 'Hey, John.' He replied, 'Batman.' I was absolutely amazed by his memory." He said they "talked about having lunch" but never did it.

Schachte said he never has been contacted by or talked to anybody in the Bush-Cheney campaign or any Republican organization. He said he has been a political independent who votes for candidates of both parties."

Clarification/Follow-up by Chouxxx on 08/27/04 7:21 pm:
It is NOT the truth, that is the point.

Facts: He served in Nam, got Medals, and got out!

Character assasination. Gossip and lies from old white guys who served in Nam and didn't like the fact that he turned on the war.

Clarification/Follow-up by ETWolverine on 08/30/04 7:12 am:
Chou,

Facts: Kerry lied to get his medals in Vietnam IN ORDER TO GET OUT EARLY.

And it is not character assasination if its true. And when EVERY LIVING COMMANDER he served under says the same thing, when EVERY ONE OF HIS FELLOW OFFICERS says the same thing, when EVEN THOSE WHO SERVED WITH HIM AND SUPPORT HIM cannot corroborate his story, and WHEN HE REFUSES TO RELEASE HIS MILITARY RECORDS then it is clear that Kerry is lying and the Swift Vets are telling the truth.

Bush spent 5 1/2 years in military service. Kerry spent 4 months in military service, and then 10 years lying about his fellow vets.

None of this is a lie. It is all part of the record.

Elliot

Clarification/Follow-up by ROLCAM on 08/30/04 7:27 am:
Dear Elliot,

I need to put the record straight.

1)I am NOT a Jew.
2)I like Jews.
3)I like Orthodox Jews.
4)I certainly meant NO offence to you or any other Jew.
5)I used the word Pharisee in the same context that Jesus used to use it.
6)The word in English has become synonymous
with HYPOCRICY and HYPOCHRITES.
7)No man in America which is described
as a hypochrite deserves such high position
in that country.

I apologise to you ,if I caused you
hurt. It definitely was not intentional.

ROLCAM.

Clarification/Follow-up by ETWolverine on 08/30/04 7:40 am:
Accepted.

Elliot