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Question/Answer
PrinceHassim asked on 06/26/07 - The Mormon Jesus is the Bible Jesus



I know some pettifogging bigots imagine they know better than I do which Jesus is my Jesus and the Jesus of Mormons, but I yield to none of their specious and twisted arguments, and here for all to see I set out exactly who my Jesus and the Mormon Jesus is.





We believe in Christ with a fixed purpose that defies earth and hell; we are Christians in the true full, literal, and complete sense of the word. We are members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints -- Mormons, if you will -- and as such we have power to become the sons and daughters of God by faith. We are all these things and much, much more because we believe the truth and have a hope of eternal life. ???

I have the real Jesus. You have any other jesus you like.


The Mormon Jesus



The ‘Mormon Jesus’ – as bigots like to call Him – was born as a babe in Bethlehem of a mortal mother, Mary, and a divine father, identified in scripture as ‘The Highest,’ and was thus the incarnation of deity. He is not the father but he is the Son of the Father, and his Only Begotten in the Flesh.

The ‘Mormon’ Jesus Christ is our Saviour and Redeemer. He it is that healed the blind, the lame, and the halt, he raised the dead, walked on the water, turned water into wine, who led men to God and who taught that there is no other way to God except through himself, the Son of God.

The Mormon Jesus was attacked by religious bigots who accused him of keeping bad company with taxmen, whores, gluttons, drunkards, and of letting his disciples work on the Sabbath when all they did was rub ears of corn between their palms and eat the kernels.

The Mormon Jesus was ridiculed, despised, and bigots and hypocrites tried to take him to kill him, eventually succeeding to kill the Son of God.

By his death on the cross of Calvary and by the shedding of his innocent blood, the Mormon Jesus paid the price for the sins of all mankind – including the sins of bigots – and enabled every man who would be clean from his sins to become clean by following his example and being baptised for the remission of sins, and thus be able to stand in a right relationship to God the Father, and having had his sins remitted, to enter into his presence and kingdom of heaven and enjoy full salvation.

The Mormon Jesus rose from the dead after three days in the tomb, and appeared to many, including Thomas who doubted that Jesus was literally resurrected, to whom Jesus gave infallible proof that he was in his own resurrected body by letting him feel him, and by eating fish and honeycomb.

The Mormon Jesus appeared to as many as five hundred brethren in his post resurrection ministry, and we know not to how many women and children.

The Mormon Jesus appeared to Paul at least six times, as recorded in the New Testament.

The Mormon Jesus neither practised nor encouraged bigotry.

The Mormon Jesus ascended to heaven in sight of his eleven apostles, who were told by an attendant angel that he would return ‘in like manner.’

The Mormon Jesus is the promised Messiah, who was to come and save the people from their sins.

The Mormon Jesus was exalted by God the Father and now sits at the right hand of the Father.

The Mormon Jesus is not God the Father, but his Firstborn and his Only Begotten.
The Mormon Jesus is that same Jesus who is found in the Old and New Testaments as Jehovah in the Old, and as Jesus in the New.

The Mormon Jesus is the Word of God who was with God in the pre-existence, and who emptied himself of the glory he had with the Father to come to earth as man-God and sacrifice his life for the sins of many.

The Jesus of the Bible is the Mormon Jesus.

The Mormon Jesus said, “My Father is greater than I!”

The Mormon Jesus said, “Not my will, but thine be done.”

The Mormon Jesus created the worlds, and is Lord of Lords, and, as the Psalmist said: "judgeth among the gods." (Psalm 82:1.) Moses might have said with propriety, he is the "living God," and the Mormons Jesus, speaking of the flesh, could say: I am the son of man. Peter, enlightened by the Holy Ghost: could say “Thou art the son of the living God,” meaning our Father in heaven, who is the Father of all spirits (Hebrews 12.9)

The Mormon Jesus said: " … I am in the Father, and the Father in me, and the Father and I are one."

No intelligent person will construe these words to mean that Jesus and his Father are one person, but that they are one in knowledge, truth, wisdom, in understanding, and purpose, just as the Mormon Jesus himself admonished his disciples to be one with him, and to be in him, that he might be in them. (see John 17.

The Mormon Jesus himself was not perfect at first; he received not a fullness at first, but he received grace for grace, and he continued to receive more and more until he received a fullness.

[The Mormon Jesus] … in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto Him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; and being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him. (Hebrews 5.7-9)

The Mormon Jesus, our Saviour, was a God before he was born into this world, and he brought with him that same status when he came here. He was as much a God when he was born into the world as he was before. But as far as this life is concerned it appears that he had to start just as all other children do and gain his knowledge line upon line. Luke says be "increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man." (Luke 2.52) John records that "he received not of the fullness at the first," but had to progress "from grace to grace, until he received a fullness." (D&C 93:12).

Before he was 12 years old, the Mormon Jesus astonished the doctors and wise men in the temple. He had learned a great deal about his Father's business. This knowledge came to him by revelation, by the visitation of angels, or in other ways. But his knowledge, so far as this life was concerned, had to come line upon line and precept upon precept.

It was the Mormon Jesus' full obedience that fully ransomed us all: "So by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous" (Romans 5:19).

Marvellous as the Mormon Jesus was, " … yet learned he obedience by the things that he suffered," and thereby the Mormon Jesus was made perfect. (Hebrews 5:8-9.)

I echo the words of Bruce McConkie, speaking a few days before his death:

”And now, as pertaining to this perfect atonement, wrought by the shedding of the blood of God, I testify that it took place in Gethsemane and at Golgotha; and as pertaining to Jesus Christ, I testify that he is the son of the Living God and was crucified for the sins of the world. He is our Lord, our God, and our King. This I know of myself, independent of any other person. I am one of his witnesses, and in a coming day I shall feel the nail marks in his hands and in his feet and shall wet his feet with my tears. But I shall not know any better then than I know now that he is God's Almighty Son, that he is our Saviour and Redeemer, and that salvation comes in and through his atoning blood and in no other way.”


Brian, if there is one thing that I will not permit you or any other bigot to do, it is to unilaterally foist on me a sub-standard Jesus of your, own manufacture that does not satisfy my personal faith and is unrecognisable to me after almost sixty years of devotion to He - whom you in your sneering cynicism refer to as “The Mormon Jesus” – who is the Lord of Creation and stood with his Father God to make the world on which we stand.

The Mormon Jesus, who is MY Jesus, is the Bible’s Jesus. He is the Jesus who is revealed throughout its pages, and he and he alone is My Jesus, the Mormons Jesus, my Saviour, the Mormon Saviour, my Redeemer, the Mormon Redeemer.

Mr Bigot,

You can repeat the lies you believe until you are blue in the face, but nothing you or anyone else can say is able to alter one yod of the truth that the Mormon Jesus is the Jesus found in the Holy Bible, and may God confound all who dissemble and prevaricate to try to have it otherwise.

Mr Bigot,

Whatever Jesus you choose to believe in, I leave entirely to you. But do not fashion a false Jesus and thrust him on me. Wear your own concoctions, and limit your dishonesty, your loathing, your hatred, your bigotry, and your silliness, to yourself and your immediate family. I’ll none of it!

Ronnie Bray - Christian and Mormon



answered on :

Ron:
Sadly, the only people who KNOW this are those intelligent enough to read both the BIBLE and the BOOK OF MORMON, with some degree of reading comprehension...unmarred by sectarian bias, and hatred of those with differing beliefs.

Realize, Ron...the if you take away the bigots sack of lies...you leave him with NOTHING!!!! And that is a fate they have not the courage to face. The cannot give up their lies, and they cannot face ANY truth that is not THEIR truth.

Mosiah 16-6ff:

"And now if Christ had not come into the world, speaking of things to come as though they had already come, there could have been no redemption.
And if Christ had not risen from the dead, or have broken the bands of death that the grave should have no victory, and that death should have no sting, there could have been no resurrection.
But there is a resurrection, therefore the grave hath no victory, and the sting of death is swallowed up in Christ.
He is the light and life of the world; yea, a light that is endless, than can never be darkened; yea and also a life which is endless, that there can be no more death."

How can any sane person read THAT and declare that the Jesus Christ of the Book of Mormon, is NOT the same Jesus Christ of the Bible?????

PrinceHassim rated this answer Excellent or Above Average Answer

Question/Answer
PrinceHassim asked on 06/27/07 - Bigots just can't [or won't] help themselves from lying!


I received this by email from an elderly Latter-day Saint lady in Slidell this morning.


My Neighbor stopped watching a T,V, Show because a MORMON BOY was on & doing Great . I told her I was a MORMON.

Then Katrina came, Who did she go to for the Tree's & Trash to be cut & carried away, but to the Group of Mormons who came from Houston Tx,

She told me she Paid them. I did know better , They were not allowed to take Money from even the Members."


I assume the Mormon was the Ken Jennings on Jeopardy.

Hundred of Latter-day Saiunts were organised by their locals to move into flooded areas and clean uop and distribute food and essential supplies, but this was done at no cost whatesoever to any recipient. That is not how the Church of Jesus Christ distributes humanitatian aid.

Why did this Bigot feel the need to tell a lie? Did Jesus put her up to it, or did someone else tell her that it is good to tell lies to Mormons?


Why do Bigots tell lie after lie after lie? Why?


answered on :

Prince:
Like the nasty little Nazi bigot, Peddler...it is bred in the bone...especially with Southern Baptist Ku Klux Kristians, who are spoon fed anti-Semitism, homophobia, and hatred of other belief systems from BIRTH!!!!! All in the name of their PURE WHITE CHRIST, of course. (They have to grit their teeth when it is pointed out that Jesus was an ORTHODOX JEW from first to last and almost as far from WHITE as you can get)!!
They LIE because it is a chronic condition, the unavoidable result of their upbringing...by fine Christian ladies who "play the piano beautifully", while the husband is out burning a cross on the lawn of a black home owner, or bombing a synagogue.

If you want to see HOW they lie, and WHY they lie: try to find a copy of Jack Nelson's blockbuster: "Terror in the Night -The Klan's Campaign against the Jews"....where you will find such bits of Christian wisdom as this, from the founder of the White Knights of the Ku Klux Klan...Sam Bowers:

"As Christians we are disposed to kindness, generosity, affection and humility in our dealings with others. As militants we are disposed to us physical force against our enemies. How can we reconcile these two apparantly contradictory philosophies?.......If it is necessary to eliminate someone, it should be done with no malice, in complete sile

PrinceHassim rated this answer Excellent or Above Average Answer

Question/Answer
cozyrozy asked on 06/30/07 - A Simple Question about the Bible

Can anyone here offer proof about the Bible?

That it is the word of God?

By proof, I don't mean belief. If you believe it, that's fine, I can respect that.

The question is about proof.

Thank you.

answered on :

No!!!! The Bible can no more be proved to be the Word of God, than the Arabian Nights Tales. It can no more be proved than the 'existence' of God can be proved. It is a document written by fallable men, and is more a litany of atrocities and obscenity than a guide to a spiritual life.

We do not even know who wrote Ninety Eight percent of the Bible, since the authors wrote anonymously, and had names appended to them, centuries after their writing, by church fathers with a private agenda. That holds good for all but a few of the Epistles attributed to Paul.

We are not even certain that what we have received as the BIBLE CANON, is what was written in the Original, since NOT ONE single original document has survived...and what we have to work with are copies of copies of copies of tranlations of translation of copies, almost 'ad infinitum'!!!!

The bible was NOT written to be taken as the literal and inerrent word of GOD, but as a record of the dealings of fallable men with what they accepted as THEIR god. It is neither the beginning, nor the end of wisdom...and were it to be taken literally THE WORLD WOULD STILL BE GOVERNED by a code that demanded DEATH for everything from fortune telling to adultery.

The Virgin Birth, The dying and resurrected Saviour, the Creation of man from dirt....are all rehased MYTH

Question/Answer
cozyrozy asked on 06/30/07 - A Simple Question about the Bible

Can anyone here offer proof about the Bible?

That it is the word of God?

By proof, I don't mean belief. If you believe it, that's fine, I can respect that.

The question is about proof.

Thank you.

answered on :

No!!!! The Bible can no more be proved to be the Word of God, than the Arabian Nights Tales. It can no more be proved than the 'existence' of God can be proved. It is a document written by fallable men, and is more a litany of atrocities and obscenity than a guide to a spiritual life.

We do not even know who wrote Ninety Eight percent of the Bible, since the authors wrote anonymously, and had names appended to them, centuries after their writing, by church fathers with a private agenda. That holds good for all but a few of the Epistles attributed to Paul.

We are not even certain that what we have received as the BIBLE CANON, is what was written in the Original, since NOT ONE single original document has survived...and what we have to work with are copies of copies of copies of tranlations of translation of copies, almost 'ad infinitum'!!!!

The bible was NOT written to be taken as the literal and inerrent word of GOD, but as a record of the dealings of fallable men with what they accepted as THEIR god. It is neither the beginning, nor the end of wisdom...and were it to be taken literally THE WORLD WOULD STILL BE GOVERNED by a code that demanded DEATH for everything from fortune telling to adultery.

The Virgin Birth, The dying and resurrected Saviour, the Creation of man from dirt....are all rehased MYTH

Question/Answer
Pericles asked on 06/30/07 - I have proof, JJD doesn't!:) ............................

Reference topic "I have proof, aton doesn't!:)" by JesseJamesDupree

JJD has promised umpteen times on different boards to stop multiple postings.

He lied. We all saw the result of those lies with page after page of his posting diarrhea.

---

JJD has suggested umpteen times on different boards to be a Christian with the best of intentions.

He lied. We all saw that his word has no value. He misuses the Christian religion to fool others to support him in his personal liquor-based terror campaign.

---

JJD has claimed many times that he did not block people on this board.

He lied. I never have blocked anyone. JJD has blocked several people.

---

I have proof, JJD doesn't!:)


;)

answered on :

Welcome back Perc!:

Poor Jesse Jane is just one more frustrated and sexually confused little pervert. She cannot handle the fact that she was rejected by DOMINO and, as you know..."Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned".

Her lies about being 'born-again' were nothing but a ploy to gain the sympathy of gullible Christians, who seem prone to forgive any kind of filth or lie or obscenity if it comes from a self-proclaimed Christian. Witness the adulation showered on HANK, our First NAZI, before WE unmasked him as the second most CHRONIC LIAR on this board. And witness how long it took the first 'self-proclaimed' Christians to admonish Jesse Jane for the unmitigated and incessant filth with which she filled THEIR Christianity board.

And witness the fact that not only ONE Christian has had the courage to rebuke the NAZI PEDLER for advocating the extermination of gay men and women.

Jesse Jane is right where she belongs, in the midst of a bunch of bigots and sanctimonious hypocrites. The three or four REAL Christians left on this board are not up to dealing with the filth pouring out of Jesse Jane, the unholy Holly, the Nazi Peddler, or the Anti-Christ Toms666....That does not say much for the 'power' of Holy Spirit does it???????

And so...to balance the books a little.....

Pericles rated this answer Excellent or Above Average Answer

Question/Answer
PrinceHassim asked on 08/03/07 - "Most Christians don't let the Bible

affect their lives.

Peddliar is a prime example of that, because the Bible does not condone lying, and Peddliar lies.

Peddliar should say Peddliar does not let the Bible affect his life! He would then be speaking the truth.



Matthew's Gospel, CHAPTER 71

Judge not, that ye be not judged.2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.


Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.


Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.


Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.


Will YOU let the Bible affect your life? Can you hear Him now?




answered on :

Peddler knows LESS about the bible than Jessica Jane Depraved and Toms666. At least Jessica has an excuse...she is a confirmed DRUNK, with NO LIFE!!!! But Peddler claims to have an entire army of Baptists and Gideons as a support group. But I guess you can't expect much support from Ku Klux Khristers, these days.
The bigots are so enamoured of the sound of their OWN voices that they will forever be DEAF to the voice of Jesus!!!! And they will NEVER know the TRUE GOD

Peric1es rated this answer Bad/Wrong Answer
PrinceHassim rated this answer Excellent or Above Average Answer

Question/Answer
peddler2 asked on 08/13/07 - Repost Due to Percs Juvenile Spamming

When Perc throws a tantrum he starts spamming louder. It is all he can do poor thing.

Ronnie-Do all Mormons promote Sodomy or Just You? peddler2 08/12/07
Recently you made a pitch for accepting sodomites, are you a sodomite? If Mormons accept sodomites can you get into heaven with spirit guys instead of spirit wives?
If so how do you populate the planet?
Enquiring minds want to know!

Clarification/Follow-up by Toms777 on 08/12/07 11:12 pm:


Good question!

domino 08/12/07
If the choice is between Ron, the most sober expert on this board, a gentleman of vast education and proven morals....and an alledgedgly 'born-again' DRUNK and EX PORN ADDICT and CHRONIC Liar and Ku Klux Khrister, ....I'd say that the Queen of Sodomy was little Missy Peddler, who waxes tearful over dear MaMa's piano playing, and literally "must rush off to the Supermarket to snatch up her goodies", but who can't seem to get her mind out of the porn shops where she spent so much of her time, seeing as she is so obsessive over penises, anuses, baby rape, and sodomy!!!
You can take the girl out of the porn shops, but you can't take the porn out of the girl!!! Only someone with a mind as polluted by pornography as Peddlers, could EVER post the obscene bullshit that she does!!!!! Funny that you and Jessica Jane Dupoop BOTH claim to be born again alcoholics, both are latent homosexuals, and both post obscene bullshit...Hmmmmmmm, seems the noose is getting tighter!!! No wonder Jessica's alter ego, the unholy holly RUSHES to post HER bullshit every time Peddler's bullshit is exposed!!!!! What an incestuous little family it is!!!! ROTFLMAO

Peddler's reply
You funny!
I must say the wonders of your mind never cease. Somehow you manage to remember to breathe while living in La La Land.
As Shakespeare said
Me thinks thou does protest too much!

It is worth noting Domino's continued preoccupation with porn sites and male sodomy. Preoccupation is a sign of obsession. Considering the last New Ager here who actively promoted sodomy was a sodomite my question was reasonable. With a pro-sodomite Mormon running for president I would like to know if the Mormons are two faced. They claim to be pro-sodomite but does their religion agree or not? Can queers go to Mormon heaven?

answered on :

Showing off what you learned in your porn obsession period, ya little pervert???? What exactly were you doing in those filthy little dens...trying to escape your MaMas stiffling embrace???
What is it with your incestuous little family, the result of a few years of backwoods inbreeding????? ...Toms666Anti-Christ; Jessica Jane Dupoop (latent or active (?) homosexual; Joy/Holly/Rosecrapper/Jacky, Schizophrenia personified; the Rabid Bitch, trying to outdo Daddy in bigotry; YOU, the most filty minded pervert of them all...so totally obsessed with Sodomy, Penises, anuses, and baby rape that you sound like you are lost in your own little dream of filth...and longing for the good old days when you could stand around masturbating in the porn shops with the other Sodomistic perverts. After slathering yourself with the blood of your lamb, I'd bet ten to one you still wacked off over images of your half-naked Christ trying to writhe out of his loincloth!!!!
You can take Peddler out of the filty porn shops, but you can't take the PORN out of Peddler...Once a filthy porn addict, ALWAYS a fitly porn addict. Only now she blames it on being seduced by her Christ!!! No wonder your dear Mama thought she saw demons floating around her head...she was mired in guilt after having given birth to a PORN QUEEN!!!!
%0

Question/Answer
peddler2 asked on 08/13/07 - Domino and Deism

domino 03/11/07
Duhhhhh!!!! Deism is not NOW, nor was it EVER a religion in the sense of Chritainity, Islam or Judaism. It has neither church, nor rituals, nor commandments...there is no 'binding back to a set of rules'.....Deism is nothing more than a "personal" belief in a "personal" God. A beleif that is based on nothing but the testimony of reason. How you react or arrange your life according to that belief is up to you.

Every religion of mankind demands a SUSPENSION of reason and logic!!!!

A personal belief in a CREATOR demands no Creed...only repressive religions need a CREDO that includes commandments that cannot be broken under pain of eternal punishment. Every mythical man-made god has been created as a vengefull, jealous, and vindictive god. NO EXCEPTIONS.


Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source
de·ism /ˈdiɪzəm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[dee-iz-uhm] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. belief in the existence of a God on the evidence of reason and nature only, with rejection of supernatural revelation (distinguished from theism).
2. belief in a God who created the world but has since remained indifferent to it.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Origin: 1675–85; < F déisme < L de(us) god + F -isme -ism]
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006.


One's belief about God is one's religion. These are the words of a God hating atheist.

domino 03/21/07
DON'T put up with it, you Pussy, go to Gombe and kill a few thousand Muslims for your blood thirsty Christ. That should prove that you are a LOT better than they. You know you are just aching to KILL for your petty desert god!!!!

Clarification/Follow-up by domino on 03/22/07 7:59 pm:
Toms777:
HATE isn't strong enough..I LOATH your monstrous desert god...as I would LOATH anyone who murders children without blinking an eye...who winks at Incest, whoredom, slavery, concubinage, adultery when it suits his perverted purpose....who teaches his followers that to kill un-believers is their duty. Too bad there is no word stronger than LOATHING!!! To assert that this MONSTER was the father of Jesus of Nazareth is nauseating. But, hey, if you create a monster god I guess you have to create a monster son to carry on the old man's traditions. Call him Beelzebub or Christ or Apollon...but DON't call him Jesus of Nazareth


The god of deism is a very convenient god for the closet atheist. He makes no rules judges no sin has no control over his creation so he may as well not exist. If he was dead as the famous German philosopher claimed what difference would it make? How could you tell?
Maybe we should call him the un-god for the unbeliever.

Historians of science believe that most if not all the so-called deist who were involved in dreaming up theories to disprove the Bible {many were openly atheists-all anti-Christian} like George Hutton were atheists at a time in history when it was not popular to be one. To say there is no God requires knowledge of everything, it is an amazingly arrogant position for a human being to take. Somehow I can't see the logic in saying he is impotent but it seems to be less offensive to most.


answered on :

How would YOU be able to recognize LOGIC, mired as you are in the Dark Ages of witch burning religious fanaticism, with a mind that has been so polluted with porn that you fixate on penises, assholes, and baby raping????

I am, however, immensely flatterd that you keep reposting my brilliant exposes of your monumental ignorance, and lying filth...it saves me the job!!!

Face it, Puddles...if you could not repost others words, cut and paste bible-babble-bullshit from 'assholes in Genesis', lie through you false teeth...you would not have a single thing to post on your own. You are dumb as a box of rocks, and can't see beyond your own genitalia!!!!

For someone who claimed to learn how to read at the age of THREE, you must have spent all of your reading hours with copies of male physique magazines, for you have learned NOTHING about God, the Bible, Jesus, or Christianity. You have NO idea of what RELIGION is; You have NOT a clue when it comes to explicating Christianity; you fall flat on your ass every time you try to interpret your OWN Scriptures.....that leaves you with one talent that you share with your clone Jessica Jane Dupoop....that is, to fill this board with your filth and your lies about every other expert EXCEPT the few members of your incestuous little family. NONE of whom have ever been able

holly. rated this answer Bad/Wrong Answer
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Question/Answer
peddler2 asked on 08/13/07 - Ronnie Promotes Sodomy-Fred will agree!

Clarification/Follow-up by PrinceHassim on 08/12/07 5:35 pm:
Homosexuality & Christianity

by Rev. Michael S. Piazza,
Dean of the Cathedral

The Bible

In our Judeo-Christian society, the documents collectively known as the Bible serve as the primary guide on most issues. It is interesting that many Christians take literally the references to homosexual acts, while interpreting other text with great flexibility. One person reported listening to a nationally-known woman speak in her campaign against homosexuality. She spent quite a bit of time quoting impressively from Leviticus. The listener accepted much of what the speaker said until he realized that, by Levitical standards, the crusader herself had broken many biblical laws – she spoke in church (1 Corinthians 14:34), she taught men (1 Timothy 2:12), she was wearing a dress made of cotton and polyester (Deuteronomy 22:11), and others of which he was probably unaware.

What does the Bible really say about homosexuality? Actually, very little. Most significantly, Jesus said nothing at all. Considering the relatively small amount of attention the Bible pays to the subject, we must ask ourselves why this is such a volatile issue. Other subjects about which the scriptures say a great deal (e.g. judgment, pride, hypocrisy) receive much less passionate attention. Before looking at specific passages, it is important to note that everyone understands the scriptures based on, and through, the light of what they have been taught. The Bible was not written in a cultural void, and many of its instructions and laws are simply classified as less relevant today (e.g. prohibition against eating pork).

Nowhere does the Bible actually address the idea of persons being lesbian or gay. The statements are, without exception, directed to certain homosexual acts. Early writers had no understanding of homosexuality as a psychosexual orientation. That truth is a relatively recent discovery. The biblical authors were referring to homosexual acts performed by persons they assumed were heterosexuals.

The Sodom Story

A chief text used to condemn homosexuality is the Sodom story (Genesis 19:1-29), often interpreted as showing God's abhorrence of homosexuality. In the story, two angels, in the form of men, are sent to the home of Lot in Sodom. While they are there, the men of the city “both young and old, surrounded the house - everyone without exception” and demanded that the visitors be brought out “so that we might know them.” (Genesis 19: 4-5) Lot begged the men to leave his guests alone and take his daughters instead. The men of the city became angry and stormed the door. As a result, they were all struck blind by the angels.

There are several problems with the traditional interpretation of this passage. Whether or not the intent of the men of Sodom was sexual, the inhospitality and injustice coming from the mob, and that generally characterized the community, were “the sin of Sodom.” (Ezekial 16:49-50, Isaiah 13:19, Jeremiah 49:18; 50:40) Jesus himself refers to the inhospitality of Sodom. (Luke 10:10-13) If the men were indeed homosexuals, then why would Lot offer them his daughters? What is threatened here is rape. The significant point, then, is that all rape is considered horrible by God. The story deserves another reading.

It should be noted that not all of the men of Sodom could have been homosexual or there would have been no need to destroy them. If they had all been homosexuals, they would have all died off leaving no heirs. Quite likely, they were a mixed group of evil men attempting to be abusive to people who were different. Ironically, lesbian and gay people are often the victim of that same sin.


Although the traditional interpretation of the Sodom story fails as an argument against homosexuality, there are several other Old Testament passages that do condemn homosexual acts. Again, it should be noted that these passages do not deal with same-sex orientation nor is there any reference to genital love between lesbian or gay persons.

Homosexual Acts

Of thousands of Old Testament passages, only two make explicit reference to homosexual acts: Leviticus 18:22 and Leviticus 20:13. Both of these passages are a part of the Levitical holiness code, which is not kept by any Christian group. If it was enforced, almost every Christian would be excommunicated or executed. It has been logically argued that science and progress have made many of the Levitical laws irrelevant. For example, fundamentalist author Tim LaHaye states that, although Levitical laws prohibit intercourse during menstruation, medical authorities do not view it as harmful, and, therefore, it should not be viewed as sinful. He further explains, “Those laws were given 3,500 years ago before showers and baths were convenient, before tampons, disinfectants and other improved means of sanitation had been invented.” (The Act of Marriage, p.275) With that, LaHaye makes this law irrelevant and rightly so. Ironically, though, in his book, The Unhappy Gay, the Levitical laws are one of the chief cornerstones of his arguments. Much of the holiness code is now irrelevant for us as moral law. Thus, having children, which was of exceptional importance to the early Hebrews, is now made less relevant by overpopulation, just as the prohibition against eating pork and shellfish has been made irrelevant by refrigeration.

The Bible never addresses the issue of homosexual love, yet it does have several beautiful examples of same-sex love. David's love for Jonathan was said to exceed his love for women. (2 Samuel 1:26) Ruth's relationship with Naomi is an example of a deep, bonding love, and Ruth’s words of covenant to Naomi are often used in heterosexual wedding ceremonies. (Ruth 1:16-17) The Bible clearly values love between persons of the same sex.

Jesus' Attitude

In the New Testament there is no record of Jesus saying anything about homosexuality. This ought to strike us as very odd in light of the great threat to Christianity, family life and the American way that some would have us believe homosexuality is. Jesus saw injustice and religious hypocrisy as a far greater threat to the Realm of God.

Episcopal priest Dr. Tom Horner has written that the Gospels imply in two places that Jesus' attitude toward lesbians and gays would not have been hostile. (Jonathan Loved David, p. 122) The first is found in the story of Jesus healing the Centurion's servant. (Matthew 8:5-13) The word used for the servant is “pais,” which in the Greek culture referred to a younger lover of an older, more powerful or educated man. Clearly, the story demonstrates an unusually intense love, and Jesus' response was wholly positive.

The other hint of Jesus' attitude is seen in his comments about eunuchs. (Matthew 19:10-12) Jesus opposed divorce in opposition to the abuses experienced by women. It is in the context of marriage that Jesus said “some eunuchs were born so; others had been made eunuchs and still others choose to be eunuchs for the Kingdom's sake.” Jesus' remarks about celibacy and castration are clear, but a male child being born without testicles is a rare birth defect. It is only in our day that the Kinsey Institute has demonstrated that sexual orientation is likely determined prior to birth. It could well be that those to whom Jesus refers as being “born eunuchs” are the people we call lesbian or gay.

Jesus' attitude toward eunuchs differed greatly from the fundamentalist Pharisees of his day. To them, eunuchs should have been excluded from the covenant and barred from worship and participating in the community of faith. Jesus' graceful approach to eunuchs is beautifully pictured in the promise of the prophecy of Isaiah, “To the eunuchs...I will give them an everlasting name that will not be taken away.” (56:4-8)

In Jesus' day there were three types of persons called eunuchs: celibates, those who were slaves and were castrated so that children would not be born to them, and those who were “born eunuchs,” or homosexuals. Royal and wealthy households used castrated slaves to work with and guard the concubines and female slaves. However, when assigning slaves to female members of the royal family, they would choose homosexual slaves. With female members, the concern was not just unwanted pregnancies but also rape.

It is against this background that we must read the story found in Acts 8:26-40. In this passage, the Holy Spirit sends Philip the Deacon to witness to and baptize an Ethiopian eunuch of Queen Candace of Ethiopia. One of the earliest converts to Christianity was a person excluded for sexual reasons from the Old Testament community.

Paul's References

Paul's statement in Romans 1:18-32 has been taken as the strongest New Testament rejection of homosexuality. He is concerned about the influence of the pagan culture on the Roman Christians. After giving a detailed description of a world that “exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshipped and served created things rather than the Creator,” he continues, “Therefore, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lusts for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men and received in themselves the due penalty of their perversion.”

A complete reading of these passages, in their original context, clearly shows that what Paul was actually referring to was homosexual temple prostitution, which was performed by various cults (though far more cults used heterosexual prostitution). Again, Paul is not referring to same-sex love, and he clearly has no concept of persons for whom this lifestyle is “natural.”

Paul's other reference to homosexual acts in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is similar to 1 Timothy 1:8-11. These two passages contain lists of persons to be excluded from the Realm of God. The interpretation of these passages depends on two Greek words that have always presented a problem for translators. In the King James Version, they are translated “effeminate” and “abusers of themselves with mankind.” In the Revised Standard Version, they were combined and rendered as “homosexuals,” however, these are not the Greek words for homosexual, so these translations reflects the scholars' bias. The New International Version illustrates the difference in these two words by translating them “male prostitute” and “homosexual offenders.” The Jerusalem Bible uses the terms “catamites and “sodomites.” Catamites were youth kept especially for sexual purpose, who were usually paid large sums of money. Neither passage refers to persons of same-sex orientation but to people who used their sexuality for personal gain.

The Love of Christ

Jesus did a great deal to change many social customs and ideas. He elevated the position of women, and, ultimately, they were his best and most faithful disciples. He did this by example and by commandments that were absolutely inclusive of the rights of all people. Yet, in the name of the Christ whose love encompassed all, the Church has been the most homophobic of all institutions. This should not be surprising when we realize that the Church is still the largest institution which is primarily racially segregated.

The final, and central, message of the New Testament is that ALL persons are loved by God so much that God's Son was sent as a means of redemption from a disease by which we are all afflicted. The cure for this disease cannot be found in any set of actions. Neither homosexuality nor heterosexuality is redemptive. God's love through Christ was given to all people.

The Theological Reflection

For the Christian, sin must be understood as a disease that results FROM a broken relationship with God and that results IN a broken relationship with one another and with ourselves. Hence, Jesus' supreme command is to love God and to love our neighbors as we love ourselves. Christianity is not a religion with new rules and laws but rather is a new relationship with God. Those things that the legalists are fond of labeling “sins” are actually just symptoms of the much deeper disease of alienation and estrangement. Much of the energy of the Church has been spent dealing with symptoms while leaving the disease intact. Jesus did not seem overly concerned about the legal transgressions of those to whom he ministered. Rather, he was much more concerned with healing the physical, spiritual, emotional and relational brokenness of people. Perhaps if the Church would again give itself to the healing/reconciling ministry of Jesus, then some of the symptoms about which we are so concerned would begin to disappear.

That brings us to the question: Is homosexuality a symptom of brokenness? In a very few cases, perhaps. Yet, pointing fingers of blame and accusation is not Christ's way. Rather, Jesus accepted people as they were and allowed love and acceptance to work its miracle. However, most lesbians and gays have been lesbian or gay for as long as they can remember. For them, it is a much a natural characteristic as their eye color or their handedness. Kinsey Institute research (University of Indiana, 1981) has suggested that homosexuality may well be genetic or, at least, linked to some prenatal factors. (Sexual Preference, Bell &Weinberg) Certainly most competent psychologists would concur that sexual orientation is set prior to the age of five in most persons. It is, therefore, not a matter of choice, so it cannot be a moral or ethical issue.

Many Christians insist that God can change/cure the homosexual. In the book The Third Sex there are six reported cases of homosexuals whom God has “cured.” Of these six, at least four are known to have returned to their gay lifestyle. (Christianity Today, February 1981) Many lesbians and gays spend most of their lives trying, with no success, to persuade God to change them. It is like trying to get God to change your eye color. What option, then, is left to these persons? They have been told that they can't be gay and Christian. Since all efforts have failed in their struggle not to be gay or lesbian, then their only recourse, according to the Church, is that they can't be Christian. So, the Church has discounted or discarded as much as 10% of the population.

If they are excluded from the life of the Christian community, who, then, will tell them of God's inclusive love and of Jesus' reconciling death? Are they left to assume that God is so narrow-minded as to exclude them for something over which they have no control and for a choice they did not make? When will the Church finally be brave enough to say with Paul, “in Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek, slave or free, male or female,” gay or straight? God has enough love for all!

Cathedral of Hope | P. O. Box 35466 | 5910 Cedar Springs Rd. | Dallas, TX 75235
Local: 214-351-1901 | Toll FREE: 800-501-HOPE (4673)


Only sodomites promote sodomy Ronnie.
Princess?

I am waiting for your explanation of Mormon views on sodomy now that I have yours.

This Cardinal is a pitiful scholar which is why he attracts you. There are many things in Leviticus that apply only to the ancient Hebrews. The best proof of why sodomy is wrong is in Genesis and Matthew. The best evidence of its punishment is in Corinthians.

Gen 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
Gen 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.


Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
Mat 19:5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh
Mat 19:6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

1Co 6:9 Or don't you know that the unrighteous will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don't be deceived. Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor male prostitutes, nor homosexuals,
1Co 6:10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor slanderers, nor extortioners, will inherit the Kingdom of God.

What does the Bible really say about homosexuality? Actually, very little. Most significantly, Jesus said nothing at all.

Again read the Bible. Jesus said:

Mat 19:4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
Mat 19:5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh
Mat 19:6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

Is that plain enough? What a lame argument ! He did not say a sodomite ménage à trois The last person here who campaigned for sodomy was a sodomite, are you?
This is further evidence you are no Christian. Jesus Christ is the Living Word.
To say He did not object to immorality is doing great violence to the Word. He did not specifically state not to have sex with babies either. Arguments from ignorance come from ignorant people. The Cardinal is no Christian either.

That same Episcopal Church this Tom Horner comes from denies the resurrection and the virgin birth but I guess you forgot to mention that. He himself wrote the book:
Tom Horner, "Jonathan Loved David: Homosexuality in Biblical Times", (1978), Philadelphia: Westminster Press.
If you don't think sodomy destroys God's Holy Matrimony you are naive.
Ronnie the Episcopal Church has been destroyed because of evil men like Horner and Spong. I think at this point I am 100% convinced you are a sodomite. This is pure evil and a direct attack on Jesus Christ and His people.

A eunuch is a castrated male. They would have no interest in sex. Some people did it so they could devote their lives to service to God or man. Some are born that way. Some had it forced on them. To classify them all as homosexual is special pleading, it is a lie.
This garbage about Jonathon and David being lovers is the absurd imagination of sodomites who want to believe that God will accept them as they are, He won't. They must repent like any other sinners. In this case some imaginary link between agape love of members of the same sex with God’s somehow approving of sodomy is suggested. Talk about homophobic! Agape love has nothing to do with sex but as the Bible says you lack natural affection so all love is Eros-sexual.

I know of more than 20 people God has cured of sodomy, there are tens of thousands. My God can take away any sin. Your God does not exist.
To some people molesting children is a s natural as breathing so by your logic we should support them.
Your reference to the Ethiopian eunuch is blasphemy and pure imagination. No where in the Bible does is even remotely suggest he was a faggot. You are changing the word of God to justify sin and the penalty for that is hell. Read the Bible Prince.

Baby rapers don't seem to be able to change either so what’s your point? Lots of people are cured from the sin of sodomy and many more would be if anti-Christians had not managed to make it illegal for a psychiatrist to even suggest to their patients they might be happier if that gave up their immorality.

It is only in our day that the Kinsey Institute has demonstrated that sexual orientation is likely determined prior to birth. It could well be that those to whom Jesus refers as being “born eunuchs” are the people we call lesbian or gay

Kinsey my foot. There is not one single shred of evidence for a faggot gene . This nonsense has no basis in fact what so ever.
You are disparaging the character of God by saying He punishes people for what He makes them do.

Much of the energy of the Church has been spent dealing with symptoms while leaving the disease intact
This is true. Sodomy is a symptom of a much greater disease. It stems from the churches rejection of Biblical authority. If the history, geology, astronomy ,paleontology ,biology and anthropology in the Bible is untrue there is no reason to believe the morality either.

The final, and central, message of the New Testament is that ALL persons are loved by God so much that God's Son was sent as a means of redemption from a disease by which we are all afflicted. The cure for this disease cannot be found in any set of actions. Neither homosexuality nor heterosexuality is redemptive. God's love through Christ was given to all people

What utter ignorance of the Bible! The message of the Bible is we all deserve to burn in hell for our sins but God loved us so much He became a man in order to pay the penalty we could not. He being perfect became sin for us. Salvation is a free gift but one must accept Jesus Christ as God and savior and

1Jo 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

You are trying to justify your sin not confess it. God is Holy and cannot let you off the hook unless you confess and repent.

You are shoving your thumb in God's face and daring Him to send you to hell.

Yet, in the name of the Christ whose love encompassed all, the Church has been the most homophobic of all institutions.

This is blasphemy to invoke the name of the living God to promote your satanic worldview. Homophobic suggest and unwarranted fear. There is the very real fear that sodomites will try and lead Christians to hell with them.

This should not be surprising when we realize that the Church is still the largest institution which is primarily racially segregated
Like that has anything to do with immorality.
This is true but you seem to suggest it is not by choice. Before the civil was my great great grandfather preached the morning service and the blacks came and joined in and on Sunday evening the Blacks preached and the Whites joined in.
After the war the Blacks were given the option to continue just as before. They decided to build their own church and prefer to be segregated to this day.
Of course there is racism on both sides but mostly it is a difference in culture that keeps worship segregated.





answered on :

The only ones obsessed with, and promoting Sodomy are the hypocritical bigots Toms666Anti-Christ, YOU, and your clone Jessica Jane Dupree. You are all so obsessed with Sodomy, male genitalia, and male asses, that you seem to salivate over them and revel in posting about them.

That kind of fascination with Sodomy and homosexuality is certainly not healthy in anyone, Let alone Ku Klux Klan Khristers.

Your god can't find his non-existent ass with either of his non-existent hands, let alone cure born homosexuals. If he is so all fired ready to cure homosexuals, why didn't he start on trying to cure Paul!!! Or David and Jonathan....or even your Christ, who not only hung around with his 12 buddies, refused to marry, and stripped naked to wash the feet of his 'budds'.....

Is that why you guys are secretly trying to promote Sodomy and homosexuality, by constantly posting about it??????? Little bit of reverse psychology going on with you little queenies????? Are you all like that great Christian heterosexual Ted Haggard....marries and preaches against homosexuals while paying male whores for their services??????? Neat little game you guys have going for you.

And YOU, you brain dead asshole...to try and equate your Christs' forbidding divorce with a denunciation of homosexuality

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Question/Answer
peddler2 asked on 08/16/07 -
Serious Bible Questions for Fred

Fred
You have accused me of misrepresenting what you belief {actually what you say are lies} about the chronology in Genesis. If this is true I will humbly apologize and I hope it is true.

Genesis 1 states the chronology of the creation of the world like this.

Day 1
Earth is created from nothing. It is formed out of water.
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

This is the end of any possibility of saying that the BB is compatible with Christianity or for the matter Orthodox Judaism. The Bible is a Jewish book and this will remain true so I will not mention Judaism again.
The BB teaches the Earth formed by chance millions of years after the sun and was white hot and slowly cooled over millions of years. Water tends to boil at 212 degrees 970 B.T.U.’s at sea level and vaporizes instantly and the incredible temperatures proposed by the BB.

Day 2
God separated the waters above and below the firmament.. Again the BB proposes incredible temperatures that would boil off all the water on earth in a matter of seconds. Actually it could never form in the first place. Please remember that the BB is an atheistic theory and presupposes no God .

Day 3
God separated the dry land and created plants and trees .The BB teaches that plants evolved over millions of years of the earth cooling off. There is light on the earth at this point but it is the light of God, the same light we will have in heaven. To accept the BB you have to accept one of the flakey compromises like day age theory or the Gap Theory.
In other words these day would have to been hundreds of millions of years. With no sun and no birds or insects to pollinate the plants and no wind to blow seeds around the plants would all die.
Interesting sidebar. The whole science of continental drift and plate tectonics was proposed the same year as Darwin published the Survival of the Favored Races by Natural Selection {1859} by the Italian scientist working in America Dr. Antonio Snyder. He based his idea of one large continent that broke apart in the Great Flood straight from the book of Genesis. To this day the greatest mind in that field bases his science on the book of Genesis. Just as science is stifled by atheism today Dr. Snyder published his book on the Pangaea theory in French as with the advent of Darwinism he could not find an English or American publisher who would help him.

Day 4
God creates the sun moon and stars. The BB says the earth evolved from the sun moon and stars. The BB is cosmological evolution, part of the atheist creation story. Bad religion supported by bad science. Again the plants have no insects or birds to pollinate them. A few plants like vanilla beans actually rely on mammals to pollinate them and they won’t be around for several billion years yet according to the BB.

Day 5
God creates birds’ fish and sea creatures. The word for great whale {Hebrew tannin} is translated as dragon everywhere else in the Bible and most likely refers to animals like the giant crocodile’s or other seemingly extinct large sea creatures.

Still no insects for the poor little plants.


Day 6 really separates the believers from the compromisers and those C.I.N.O. .
On day 6 God created ALL THE ANIMALS and the insects and man..
I emphasized the all the animals for a reason. It was a creationist who found the first dinosaur and a creationist who coined the word dinosaur but for about 160 years the atheists have repeated the motto “No man has seen a living dinosaur” umpteen billion times and most people accept it on the flimsiest of evidence, actually on the lack of evidence.
God said here in Genesis He created all the land animals and that would include the dinosaurs all in one day. He confirmed that in Job 40:15. Fred there is a much better argument that man and dinosaurs lived at the same time from historical records and forensic science but that is not the bottom line for a believer. The bottom line for a believer is that the Bible is God’s word and it says that God created the dinosaurs on day 6.
But Fred you don’t even want it to be true. That is why you bury your head in the sand. If the Bible is true how could you remain a Catholic? You don’t want it to be true because people will laugh.
True believers will not compromise and if someone laughs we feel sorry for them because God said if you don’t believe Moses you don’t believe Him.

You tell me? Do you believe the chronology in Genesis? Do you believe the Earth was made first and there was no millions of years of intense heat? That the plants were created before the sun? Do you believe that every kind of animal that ever existed was created the same day as Adam was? Not every variation like every different variety of pigeon or elephant etc. who adapted through Natural Selection but all the basic kinds including dinosaurs?









answered on :

PeddlerSodoma:
YOU LYING LITTLE SLUT....not only have you TRIED to misinterpret what Fred believes, but what Ronnie believes, what domino believes and, in fact ANYONE who has the knowledge and the intelligence to blow your idiocy out of the water.

Not you, nor anyone living or dead can determine WHAT the word of god is....especially the drivel that pours out of your Bible...that mish-mosh of lies, errors, contradictions, ammendments and deliiberate fraud. You cannot even determint who WROTE the books of the bible, let alone that they were inspired by ANY god. Genesis alone makes your god sound like an addelpated inventor who just couldn't get it right the first time, and who 'inspires' two different accounts of his alleged 'creation'...one having the animals created before man, one having man created before the animals...And then being stupid enough to have plants growing BEFORE the sun was 'created'!!! Coldn't even decide whether he had created "him" or "them" or whether what he created was male, female, or both!!!!!
We are also treated to a god so bemused that he did not know when he created ADAM that he would later 'discover' that "it is not good for the man to be alone"...how long did it take the celestial Edison to figure THAT out???? And then to parade all the animals in front of Adam befor

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Question/Answer
peddler2 asked on 08/18/07 - Great Pyramid Theories


If you base your religious beliefs on un-provable assumptions from science the word fact and belief get confused. Fact becomes what you believe and no evidence to the contrary will be considered. Sadly this trait is shared by atheist and pseudo-atheist New Agers over the age of the earth.
The evidence that can be interpreted as great ages is limited to starlight and time, radiometric dating and ice cores. The only one that cannot be easily dismissed is starlight but either way you interpret that evidence you share the problem so to choose one theory over another when both have the exact same problem is illogical. The ice cores have been completely refuted by counting the rings that “prove” WW2 airplanes which landed in Greenland have been there for 250k years. Radiometric dating has been disproved by helium diffusion and the fact that all the methods but 2 give greatly conflicting answers etc.
So you have I fairly good argument and two very weak arguments for great ages which can also be interpreted as young ages.. On the other hand there are 24 methods of dating that cannot be interpreted as long ages at all. One of them as Math said is history . Human history only foes back as far as the Bible says it does.There is no living thing that can be demonstrated to be older then the Great Flood, population, salt in the oceans, lunar regression, short ,period comets, long period comets, the magnetic cores of Earth as well as Venus ,Mercury ,Saturn Venus and Neptune, the spin of the earth ,continental erosion and on and on. Yet the atheist and the New Ager refuse to even look at all this evidence all the while considering themselves open minded.

Domino applies the same logic to the Great Pyramid
Different theories.

The Great Pyramid of Giza is the oldest and largest of the three smallest cok pyramids in the Giza Necropolis bordering what is now Cairo, Egypt in Africa, and is the only remaining member of the Seven Wonders of the World. It is believed to have been built as a tomb for Fourth dynasty Egyptian pharaoh Khufu (hellenized as Χεωψ, Cheops) and constructed over a 20 year period concluding around 2560 BC.[1] . It is sometimes called Khufu's Pyramid or the Pyramid of Khufu.[2]
In the Great Pyramid of Giza he discovered ancient graffiti in Relieving Chambers, with the name 'Khufu' and 'Khnum-Khufu' enclosed in cartouches. There has been some degree of controversy regarding the validity of the graffiti discovery and its potential forgery by Vyse and his colleagues [2], however given its precarious location it is hard to believe it could have been inscribed after construction

So there is a controversy there but regardless of which side is correct that does not prove who actually built it just who commissioned it.
http://www.harvardmagazine.com/on-line/070391.html
An article in Harvard Magazine suggests that the workers were not slaves. I find the argument unconvincing and seeing that Harvard is spending a million dollars to disprove the existence of God one cannot consider them unbiased. The article itself snubs the Bible.
Neverthe less it shows that who built the Pyamids is not a known fact.

This site confirms the controversy.
http://www.sacredsites.com/africa/egypt/great_pyramid.html
The attribution to Khufu of the Great Pyramid is founded solely upon three very circumstantial pieces of "evidence":
 The legends told to and reported by Herodotus who visited the pyramids in 443 BC
 The funerary complex near the Great Pyramid with inscriptions citing Cheops/Khufu as
the reigning pharaoh
 In the pyramid itself, on a granite slab above the ceiling of the main chamber, some
small, red ochre paint marks that have a slight resemblance to a hieroglyphic symbol for
the name of Khufu.

Yet another dissenter.
Who built the Great Pyramid?
One of the enigmas about the Great Pyramid is who built it. There are many theories, but certain factors have to be taken into consideration in answering this question. For example, the astronomical calculations found on the Great Pyramid determine that is was literally impossible for the Egyptians to have designed it.
Quoting Max Toth’s book points out his fact. "Nonetheless, Egyptians are thought to have been exceedingly backward in astrology; their meteorology and division of the seasons in their system has convinced researchers that no true system of cosmology could have originated among them. These researchers indicate that Egyptian astronomy was primitive (p. 192)."

The fact is that the pyramid is there. Everything else is conjecture. We were not there and have no clear historical record. The majority of academia wants to convince people the Bible is untrue. So they dismiss any evidence that suggests it is and presents their own opinion as fact.

answered on :

Assholina:
Science does not deal with ASSUMTIONS, but with hypotheses and theory than can either be proved or disproved. It is only religon that is based on unprovable ASSUMPTIONS....like dead men rising from the grave and flying off to to some Celestial disneyland....or leprosy cured by a snotty handkerchief!!!

As to the Pyramids, you are...as usual...about FIFTY YEARS behind the times. Not only have archeologists found out WHO built the pyramids of Giza, (and the other 80 pyramids that still exist) but they have discovered the ENTIRE CITY, on the Giza Plateau, in which the workmen (and their families) lived, and records of the PAY and RATIONS they received. A measure of your blind ignorance is in ignoring the records that exist for even the FIRST PYRAMID built in Egypt, the Step Pyramid designed and built for King Dzoser by his architect Imhotep, Three Hundred years BEFORE the Great Pyramid of Khufu, and the lesser Pyramids built for King Unas and his daughter!!! The Pyramids were not built by "slaves" but by highly skilled corps of masons, mathematicians, surveyors, stonecutters and thousands of 'grunt' laborors "working for the glorification of their GOD-KING"!!!!!!

Get your head out of your ass, pudd...and catch up to the 21st Century. The Pyramids don't have a damn thing to do with your b

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